Kingdom Hearts II Was Sora justified? *Spoiler*

Ah well. I doubt we were meant to look this closely into it.

Besides, the org still has a chance of returning, if Nomura holds true.

 

I win. *dances around*

However, as said, I do not say that the Org is 'evil' either, ICSP. Please understand that. They are guilty for the way they handled things. However, we need their side of things as well to prosecute them justly to see if their charges would hypothetically get lowered based on events that transpired which we will learn in BBS and 358/2 Days. I do feel sympathetic to them and all. I just knew Sora also wasn't out with the intentions that you assigned to him. He's definitely not a person that himself justifies murder. In movies etc, I can often see (when movies care to explain it, or books etc) why the antagonists are where they are but won't really hate the hero for it. Someone had to do something with what was presented.

Do I think if the Org lived they should get a fair trial as well? Sure thing. We out here from the game know that more is up with what Xemnas was doing. He's either linked to one of two people. Xigbar was doing something and we can't be sure what but Nomura queued us in that he has a rather important past. So this is what we need to see that will at all let people comprehend the Org more than it does at the moment. Even with that knowledge though, Sora would be found innocent because of the way the Org played out things. However, I do state for the record, this knowledge may change some views on just what the Org's actual functions were and why the Nobodies were made in the first place.

 

One question, Repliku.

Worst case scenario (for us): Days reveals that the Org was never trying to hurt Sora until the end, and that the kingdom hearts they made would change all heartless and Nobodies back to their original selves, and the original Six would reform their behaviour.

I know this is near impossible, I just want to hear how you will justify it. Does your argument still work?

 

I do believe this may be true... Not near impossible, but just as likely as not. Maybe not every heartless, but at least every nobody. (Not all heartless have nobodies)

But... if it is true... you better bet I am going to Necro bump this thread... with a caramel dance!

Sorry... nothing explains ultimate childish joy quite like that song...

 

Yes, the situation would still stand. As I said, even if the Org has some 'charges' dropped because of the niceness of Court removing things due to circumstances, Sora would still ultimately be found innocent because of the methods the Org employed. They -did- attack him and others. That is clear.

In the end, the point would be that the Org would have been up for debate on -their- actions and held accountable. Sora would not be an issue. And you know what? I bet you if the Org was put on trial somehow, Sora would be there and try to not be too hard on them. If he saw that the group wanted to reform their behavior, he'd support them. This is what is funny. Sora gets slammed on but he's the one, with Riku, who would go ahead and SUPPORT the Org if they wanted to change their ways. I can't see Sora as one who advocates punishing someone that would turn things around.

 

Hmmm... it's hard to say. If I remember correctly, the Organization WAS using Sora (and Roxas) to help them become whole, and I think create a new world for them to live in and 'belong'. But that's just me. You can say he had the right to, but Axel and possibly a few other members were REALLY just trying to find a 'place to come back to'.
Like in the novels. They didn't know what to believe in (Axel and Namine) and are confused about what's right and wrong. But for members like Marluxia, no offense, Sora had the right to destroy him. (Abusing him, Namine, AND Vexen) (sorta). *coughcough* Sorry that was so long...

 

no, he wasn't.

 

I dont think he was, he didnt even give them a chance to explain their actions. The way he handled heartless was fine, but the way he did with the nobodys was wrong in my opinion, since they werent just mindless creatures.

 

To be fair, when did the nobodies offer information? They just showed up, laughed at Sora, and vanished. Sora saw enough of them. He saw Xaldin coerce Beast, he saw all of them attack holobastion. He never had a proper chance to ask what the org was doing.

 

this is a very complex question but from what im thinking and seen sora was justified the agendas of the organization as a whole was quite a delema. dangerous to the worlds in fact. if they collect hearts(unstable as you know) creating more nobodies there power will escalade out of control then what will sora do? the simple answer is that he was

 

The question at hand is "was Sora justified" not "was the org justified" That thread would have a far different answer.

 

Yes. They killed many, many people for their own selfish gain.

 

They did not kill anyone... and it was a selfish gain. But they did it on thier own... the only "bad" to come out of it was Sora had to kill heartless...

 

Oh yeah. Exploitation and mind control of a kid isn't evil at all...

There was also the kidnapping of Namine. Oh, and cloning is illegal these days, so Repliku's mere existance is a no-no too. Plus, several attempts of murder. Theft, terrorism.. Need I go on? No matter what evidence you bring to the table, the Organization would be dead in the water.

 

Not when you compare it to the other option... letting heartless run rampent and wiping out worlds. Basically you have too choices... heartless being and picked to die at Sora's hands... or wild heartless eating worlds... how evil is that?

Namine was not kidnapped blah... I've been through this arguement to many times. There is no proof she did not want to be there... as the Castle Oblivion incident was all her fault anyway.

Theft? Where? Do not say "Olympus Stone" or you will just make yourself look bad.

Terrorism? I don't see terror tactics being used at all.

Deep water? Oh... you mean Demyx right?

 

Uh, Heartless commit manslaughter, and therefore, would probably die due to the Death Penalty either way. Unless.. you can explain to me how Heartless don't kill people. Sora is a soldier, in a war against the Heartless. You wouldn't go to Iraq and arrest everyone who was ever there and shot down the enemy, would you?

True, I guess. But no matter how you look at it cloning is bad, so I got you there. ;D

Xaldin steals the rose. :P

Xaldin uses terrorism against the Beast. He takes his fear from rejection, and staying a horrible creature, and his random anger, to turn him against others.

Oh, and Axel kidnaps Kairi, and she struggled a plenty.

 

I see no logic in that post.

Basically Organization XIII killed many heartless indirectly by directing them too Sora... heartless which would otherwise have been killing people 24/7. So basically Org XIII saved countless people from dieing.

Not to a liberal scientist. Some countries do not ban cloning. The Sixth Day law has not been passed universally. Don't push me on this much further...

Holy Crap!!! He stole a flower!! OMG KILL HIM!!! -_-

that was sarcastic in case you could not tell....

Xaldin did a lot of things on his own. Its canon. Xaldin =/= the org.

Again I highlight that Xaldin acted independantly, as did many Org members.

Also, Beast being scared of rejection is his problem, not Xaldin's. Are you going to call me a terrorist if I make fun of a self consios person? No... that is a ludicrous arguement.

You defeat yourself. Axel kidnapped Kairi in an act of betrayal from the Organization.


Sorry... I don't mean to sound like a troll... but I've been through this too many times. Making the same argument over and over. Its quite annoying... forgive my lack of patience.

 

Don't worry about it, whadda you want me to do, read the whole thing? XP

So, Org. XIII still committed manslaughter. Or is it heartlessslaughter? ._.

Fine sir, we live in the U.S of A. :X

How is Xaldin NOT part of the Organization? Yes, he acted on his own, but was it not for the benefit of himself, and the Organization as a whole?

No, but if you got them to try and kill people, and shove people into a basement, and lock them down there, then yes. I would.

Oh yeah. But then Saix picked her up, to control Sora, if I remember correctly. ._.

 

No... just all my post... J/K I'm sure you have a life.

Thelet heartless die in order to save people... its heartless slaughter.

I live in the World That Never Was... laws are different here.

You just admitted he acted on his own. If your best friend goes and robs a bank, and splits the money with you. You have no idea he robbed a bank... is it fair to charge you with bank robbery? Or even accessory? No... you had no idea. So why charge the Org with everything Xaldin did? I'm sure Demyx could do nothing about what Xaldin did in Beast's Castle... he probably had no idea.

Who did they try to kill? Seriously... I have no idea...

And the alternate was to let Axel torture her to turn Sora into a heartless...

*Sigh*

 

Yes. It is. >X

Wait.. you do? Since when does TWTNW have law, let alone people to enforce it?

It's not fair, but as long as you have that money in your possession, your an accessory. That's like buying crack, under the guise that it was sugar or something. Your still going to jail for drug possession.

Uh, Sora? Several times? Leon, in the bastion. Everyone in Radiant Garden, during the siege. (Which I'm pretty sure they controlled.)

When did Axel say he was gonna torture her? Wasn't he using her as bait to get Sora to come, so he could turn Sora into a heartless, so he could hang out with Roxas some more? ._.