The Golden Compass

Meh. I don't see a problem with the movie. Whether or not what is in it is appropriate or not, if people would just realize it was completely fantasy, then maybe there'd be less problems.

Mainly the church. <_<;

 

I believe Pullman greatly dislikes that people refer to his books as the "Anti-Narnia", he never intended for his series to be that, and it's an atrocious example of how everything in our culture has to be labeled and associated with something else. All he wanted to do when he made the series was explore his own questions and philosophies about Religion through a story, and perhaps via that his readers could reach their own conclusions.

 

I thought he just liked to make a cool fantasy series. Can somebody please explain to me why it's supposly 'against' the church?

 

it is bad because the author doesn't believe in christ

 

That has absloutly nothing with the book stupid. Okay, if someone were not to believe in christ, and wrote a book, your saying that the church would say that the book is evil because the author dosn't believe in christ? Not to be mean or anything, but what you said was like one of the most stupid thing I have ever read in this thread so far. You can't judge the book by it's cover, in other words, in this situation, you can't judge the book by it's author.

 

Look the guy who made the book came out and said that he was deliberatley trying to steer people away from God. That made a lot of people have biased fellings about the movie.

But I don't think that it's nice to try to trick yonug people who believe in God to like become atheists. Christians try to steer people to God but most of them don't push it on them.

This movie I'm not going to see it because of 1. I'm a Christian and I'm not going to givs this guy money for opposing my beliefs. 2. Talking Polar Bears. that's not right.

 

and where did he say this? And did you ever bother to check the context of the statement?

I'm sorry, but how is it a trick? He wrote a fantasy book series that explores questions and doubts of faith that every person has no doubt asked themselves at one point, but never dwelled on, and fabricates an adventure out of it full of the same moral values that any other story would tell you.

His Dark Materials are no more a trick than Star Wars, or Harry Potter. Unless, you want to say that similarly, The Chronicles of Narnia are a blatant and devious trick of equal standards.

Hold on, do you live in the real world?

"I'm not in the business of offending people. I find the books upholding certain values that I think are important. Such as that this life is immensely valuable. And that this world is an extraordinarily beautiful place, and we should do what we can to increase the amount of wisdom in the world'." -Phillip Pullman

 

I'm sorry but look, as a Christian one of my duties is not to conform to the World. Another one is to see through deception. I mean it doesn't matter if it is a kid book or movie! It matters what message is getting through to kids. You may think nothing is getting to them but if they were like me when I was younger they like to get answers to questions that many people can't answer like,"When is the world going to end," and,"How old is God?" obviously the media is racking their brains trying to think of something for kids to get into and spend all their time and money on it.

They want us to live a fantasy that's heading toward a path of destruction! Most of the media. Maybe just this movie and commercials though.

Anyway if you won't listen to me then fine. I'm not going to force it on you. Just to be straight foward I'm making some suggestions. Okay?

btw- I live in the real world I'm just in my head thinking about everything all the time

 

Um...I don't know what rock you've been hiding under here. Christians make things all the time to turn people to God. Missionaries go to other countries and along with a 'cure' for some malady pass people Bibles and pretty well force religion on them. I've witnessed it as it happened to me and others. Christians also have been condemning others that if they don't believe in what they do they will go to Hell. I'm sorry but cursing someone to an afterlife of misery that you believe in because someone else does not believe as you do is -pushing it-. Funding things through religion so it can spread its message at people who don't want to hear it is -pushing it-. Trying to force those who aren't of Christianity to see the 10 Commandments in public schools is -pushing it-. Also, lets not forget things like how scientists were suddenly 'Christian' again at their dead bed when these notions never truly happened but it sure hit the paper, such as with Darwin. I could go on and on with examples, but I think I've made enough of a point that the facts go against your statement.

As for this movie, it is a fantasy story. It amazes me how Christians can force things at others repeatedly but something that may symbolize something against the religion is suddenly evil and blasphemous. How many Christians throughout the ages have shot down every other deity and forced it to become a 'myth' now? I would think Christians could stand to stop their demonstrations and let a movie be a movie and a book be a book, regardless of what it says in its pages.

Christians are -not- martyrs, yet the extremists always want to make them out to seem that way and I seriously doubt this movie is going to promote a ton more recruits to Atheism. Most people, after all, go to watch a movie because...it's a movie! Oh my. Christianity and Islam interchangeably are the top two religions in the world. It is -not- threatened and seriously, thinking so is zealous, and to me, bordering on insanity. Millions of people are Christians. I don't see millions of them saying 'well this movie changed my whole view so now, I don't believe'.

Christianity has a tremendous amount of great people who aren't so thin skinned and a silly book or movie is not going to shake their resolve or make them question their beliefs. So fanatic Christians are the ones in the end who think they must 'save the world', 'save people's souls', remove all of the enjoyable things in life because it's a sin, say we are all born in absolute sin and must believe to be saved, compromise their own 10 Commandments such as stealing and lying to preserve their images, and -hate- anything that questions or denounces their religion while they ridicule, mock and destroy everyone else's beliefs.

In all seriousness, I do ponder why more Christians who seem to actually follow it better and read the book themselves don't get fed up with fanatics and tell them to sod off, because their reactions really make others look bad and at the same time the fanatics are telling regular Christians that they are -too weak willed- to watch a movie and not be deterred from their paths. If a movie or book can shake a person's devotion so much, that person had to have doubts in the first place and shouldn't we remember that life is about personal choice and growth and let each person experience his/her own life? Jesus never seemed so violent as the zealots out there that are the chief reason if anything that others find Christianity hard to swallow. They are a scourge in themselves and more deadly than any Atheist writing a book will ever be to the religion.

 

Yeah see did you see my next post. You should try reading it thank you very much.

I don't know what's wrong with you people and religion. I mean if you guys are okay with all of this other stuff like having a baby before your married before you can take care of one. You should be okay with Christians!

Not all of us are bad. All atheists aren't bad either. I'm just against what they believe okay? Why do you always have to go after people who have their own beliefs. Just cause you think there's nothing after you die doesn't mean we do. We try to give people hope for after they die unlike the people who have no idea.

What's wrong with believing your own beliefs. It's as dumb as the school teacher's teddy bear being named Mohammad.

Unless you've had a personal experience with a CHRISTIAN not catholic, that has actually forced you into Christianity then be quiet!

 

"conform to the world".....what does that even mean!?

Religion itself is deception, you clearly didn't see through that one, eh?

His Dark Materials are no more a trick than Star Wars, or Harry Potter. Unless, you want to say that similarly, The Chronicles of Narnia are a blatant and devious trick of equal standards.

You say "it matters whats getting through to the kids"...then why is it suddenly okay for blatant Christian propaganda to be tossed around? You should be taking the same stance on The Bible, or The Chronicles of Narnia, or any book with Christian values, riiiiight?

And how is "The Golden Compass" any different from that? All "The Golden Compass" does is allow us to question what we've been told, it allows us to experience the doubts that everyone feels at any one point, it lets you read an adventure and draw conclusions for yourself, or make peace with your own beliefs.

This is funny because the Christian faith makes a habit out of condemning everyone to Hell if they don't share in their beliefs, trying to convert as many people as possible, and has had a history of War that could have been prevented if Christians were okay with "letting everyone have their own beliefs"

And Condemn everyone to Hell if they don't believe in what you do? Mmhmm

Religion isn't a peace of mind, or a hope for an afterlife. It's nothing more than a burden on the life you're living right now, which makes you dance for the puppetmaster in the hopes that there's some magical land after you die, that way you forget about living this life and instead worry and hope that there's one after this one where things will be better.

And how is this dumb? It's nothing more than a name.

Should I not be allowed to be named Christopher?

 

well i dont know if any one said this but, i am christan and i listened to the commercials and it comes down to me as if all they are really trying to kill God.
" there is only one golden compass left and who ever can read it can rule the universe."

still i listen to rock music and emo music and dont really care what they say, but coming to finding an item to kill God, it makes no sence.

yes i know that i have bad grammer but i know that others can read it. if yall need help reading it ask me what i mean.

" his dark materials" the series that the movie was based of of may be a book and there are books that do talk about this but movies will can be boycotted by religous members and then a big debate will start.

 

This is funny because it's incorrect, as The Golden Compass doesn't involve the plotpoint of "killing God" at all, and it doesn't come into effect until the 3rd book in the series

Again, incorrect, the Alethiometer doesn't do anything of that sort.

Even if it did, would you say Lord of the Rings is evil? "The One Ring" and all?

The Alethiometer doesn't "kill God", and it's an actual device from ancient Greek times that was believed to be able to "read truth". Which is precisely what it does in the series, the person who can read the Alethiometer can sense the truth in the world.

 

I did read both of your posts, and do not appreciate on being called out on it, thank you. You obviously though did not read mine. I said Christian Extremists are the problem here; NOT Christians themselves. Now you go doing exactly the route of pulling out the 'Martyr Card' and do not get what I am saying. Read Pullman's own quote. His problem is with Organized Religion or really any fascist group that comes together, has tyranny and tries to control people. Christian ZEALOTS think that Christians are so weak that they can't watch a movie and feel it should be boycotted and all because it has some anti-Christian messages but they miss the point that it is NOT anti-Christian. It is anti-theocratic. Because the books were written in a setting of Europe, what religion is going to be mentioned and utilized? Christianity seems to make sense as if it was Islam or Judaism, Hindu or Buddhism etc...people would believe it was something of a statement against immigrants etc who did not believe as the local people did. The point of the books and the movies was NOT to say that Christianity itself was bad, but that an evil theocracy could be because people would not look and see how tyrannical and rotten their leaders who teach them worship are.

So, in the end, I hold no views against Christians themselves and in reality I don't think Pullman does either, despite him being Atheist. Christians really need to stop hating on Atheists so darn much because they MAKE them a threat when the true enemy to any religious believer should be those zealot fanatics that do things in the name of a deity that is simply extreme, takes away life, privileges and joys for anyone else and oppresses them. The true disease that can be creeping in any religion is that people cover for these others who consider everyone else to be pathetic little sheep. I do not attack Christianity. I attack fundamentalist view points that feel they can let people watch Christian things all of the time and force it down our throats, and many of us who do not believe do not utter much of a complaint at all....and the next thing you know, something that says anything negative with the word 'Christianity' in it is automatically stood against by mass forms of people, people are ostracized clearly as you can even see in the people's posts here, and attempts to boycott it and forces of negativity arise by CHURCHES. Who are these people who can tell others to NOT watch something? Christians and others are NOT stupid. We have cognitive minds and can deduce things for ourselves. If you do not want to see the movie, fine, don't. No one should tell others that they cannot see it because it goes against their religious belief. No one should use religion as a weapon which is done all of the time and people get away with it because religion is deemed to be more protected than other human rights.

Also, I dealt with Protestants and Catholics, and mostly Protestants that were more determined to thrust Christianity on me as well as Southern Baptists. So truly, you don't even know the faces of zealots masquerading around in your own area and it does not bode well for you to assume that one is always speaking of the Catholic Church because no, I certainly was not. Protestant extremists are also the ones who are raising mass groups of people to believe that the moon still shines its own light and denounce all science.

Lastly, do not tell others to be quiet. You want your voice heard so expect others to be heard or do not come and sit at the little debate table. If you do not like what is being said, try responding with actual material to support things. Your viewpoints on 'saving people' are your own as well, and though I disagree with you, guess what? I'm not going to tell you that you are less than me or try to raise myself on a pedestal and tell you to shut up. It IS what you believe and this is the point of the whole argument, isn't it? What people believe in should not determine what OTHERS can watch. Religion is a PERSONAL choice. It is not something you have the right to silence, nor to say you can silence other people's opinions on it. You believe what you want. Let others watch, see, read, feel etc what they want to, whether they are Christian or not. If anything, my posts are actually trying to defend those Christians that have free-thinking minds and are getting abused by people who deem them too weak-willed to handle watching a freaking movie. This is exactly what Pullman is saying. Organized theocratic or zealous groups in power can become corrupt and no one should have that power to take away personal freedom of thought. If you do not agree with that, do not toss that Martyr Card out again on the table. It simply will not be acknowledged.

And rethink that. Some of us don't want to live in your little world of conversion and that equates to slavery.

 

lol Are you saying that being threatened with going to hell; to live and to suffer for the rest of eternity, is JUST AS EASY TO HANDLE as having a baby?

Please, rethink your statements.

1. Yes. YOU are against it and don't care what others think. But look at the globe--the HISTORY of all Christianity. Bloodshed, murder, depression--it's all there. *You* may not do those things, and may not promote it. But the religious leaders do. THAT is what the whole point is.

2. Yes. Having hope after you die is a very, very nice though. I would honestly love to believe that we'd all go to heaven after we die. Sadly, I don't. Because once the evidence of the religion itself is weighed, there's high odds that the concept of the after world is nothing more than a fairy-tale idea. Besides, would staring at God for the rest of your life really be any better than eternal darkness? Ask yourself that. lol

How is it dumb that a teddy bear has the name Mohammad? :/ And there is nothing wrong with having your own beliefs. It's just the religious establishment that pushes it on people, and makes a lot of non-believer's annoyed; as well as quite angry. You can have your belief, but leave me with mine. That is all I mean to imply. It works BOTH WAYS. Atheists could really care less about Christianity. Sure, if it weren't here things might be a little less masss-influencd, but it's not a big deal.

Catholocism is the same thing as Christianity. It's just a sect, lol.

 

Guys I'm not going to push you on this because it's your choice.

I'm just saying I'm not giving this guy money for saying what I believe isn't true.

That's all to it there's really no need to anylize what I say unless your thinking that what I say is true (or if your slow :p)

Anyway it's your problem if I don't wanna see the movie and you guys are like your a bigot because the people LIKE you push things on other people who don't believe in religion.

I don't like to push people so I don't. It's as simple as that.

btw catholics are people who believe in God but they thank Mary for having Jesus. Not that different but it has a couple more differences.

 

i love this movie and thus i started to read the books and i think as normal the catholic church is over reacting (and im roman catholic)
but all in all i get where there coming from its just them being like an overproctecting mother that doesnt want there childeren to go on the wrong path
but like most mothers...they dont trust us that much

 

Actually...

I have actually READ some of these Christian reviews. Not from Yahoo where all the bible thumpers *no offense to anyone* are typing that it's the devil and satan will rise and cause a burning inferno...

But actual reviewers from the christian websites. They actually enjoyed the movie, and believe it or not... I'm not lying here... Are PULLING beliefs from the movie and comparing it to god.

Another part I found interesting in my own POV is that they have read all the books. And they actually do say what happens and encourage kids to read it, just for them to think and learn. They point out several facts from the book that at the end don't make it sound as "athiest" if you will as what the others are saying.

And Pullman isn't an athiest. If he was, he wouldn't believe in God. He might want to be, but he's not, I say he's an extreme agnostic. A questioner in the faith and against god and his beliefs.

In any case, it still hasn't changed my mind about the parents and bible thumpers who want to basically ban the movie because of their beliefs and try to impose their beliefs about not seeing the movie...

But it also makes it interesting in my POV that a lot of the critics, CHRISTIAN and Catholic critics are taking this a lot better and even saying: "Hey, bring the kids and let them figure it out themselves."

It's something in my own POV that should be considered. After all, God did give you the chance to think. If he didn't, we wouldn't have a chance to think at all, period. It's called free will to decide what to do with it. And like it has been said...

If you seriously think that you aren't going to make it through one movie without holding your beliefs. You have to wonder if you even had the right beliefs in the first place.

And that's what I think the church is afraid of.

And yes, at the end of the last book, they do "kill God." Believe me or not. But even the critics said themselves that they had a reason and a right to. Not the same as what people believe.

Take my opinion, or leave it.

 

I think what the churches are afraid of is that people think that they can "kill God". Where I live the movie theater area is backed up (which is bad for me because that's where everything is). I think that's basically it. After talking with people. I'm still not going to see the movie because I want to go see "Enchanted" because I'm young at heart and I want to see a Disney movie.

Also the annoying kid at school who is a "know it all" will kill me.

I don't exactly like the fact that the guy's purpose in this book is to impose that God can be killed (basically). But the movie might be better

I'm just gonna wait until it's on Nick.

 

the authot said himself that his main reason he wrote the book was so people didnt beileve in god