Chain of Memories If Marluxia Won...

Lol xD *gives ICSP a hug because she wants to and cause he did a good job*. I was expecting to answer to another post of yours, so at first I was surprised xP.

The only reason why people think Marluxia is a pansy is because of his pink hair, and flowers, but whoever says, "MARLUXIAHASPINK@#2;LOLZ HESUCKZERZ!1", is considered a n00b to me, because that isn't..him. I've still yet to see someone who takes Marluxia's design seriously. Though I think people say it mostly for jokes and all....*looks at "Marluxia''s Element" thread*

PS: Oh...you didn't like Xemnas? >.< Now I get why he isn't in your story? ^^;

Anyway, I'm going to get back to the chapter, almost done, you know xP. I still want to see what Repliku says about the "Room Of Sleep", however....

 

indeed, i didnt care what color his hair was, i could tell he was intelegent from the look in his eyes, they kinda said 'evil coniving bad guy' to me

plus he uses a super-cool-awesome scythe

 

I'm utterly astonished that Nomura says Xaldin was one of the strongest. I thought he was below Marluxia and above Xigbar. But 3rd? He didn't do ANYTHING. Axel wasn't even backing down to him, but when Xemnas got in his face he left. I rarely go against the creator of something, but that statement doesn't make much sense to me.

 

Thanks, TwilightNight... I need consolation after I lose an arguement.

I think Nomura is refering to the character design he is based off of. He is actually based off Kain, from Final Fantasy 4.

I believe Nomura loves Kain, becuase he made a cameo in FF3, and FF9. He was a main character in FF4. He is reffered to in FF2, FF5, FF6, FF7, FF Tactics, FF Tactics Advanced by name.

His name is also used in KH1. Whover guesses where, gets a cookie!!!

Basically, he has made more cameos than anyother character in Square history!*

Also, his character design of Xaldin is obviosly Kain.

Bottom line, I think Nomura has a minor obsession with Kain...

Oh, and in case you didnt notice, I'm a Kain fanboy too.


*Other than Cloud. But duh, Cloud is there money maker.

Wow... sorry that was way off topic.

Ok, Marluxia still could have won. I think Nomura was thinking about Marly being dead when he listed Xemnas, Roxas, and Xaldin in that order.

 

Uh...his name is mentioned?

Well, I wouldn't know since I don't have the game...

Hollow Bastion, maybe?

 

well,... with Marluxia, things would be a lot less Darth Vader--ish,... and more... homo-sexual--ish

but I can't see the Order XIII under him...

Zexion, maybe

but not Marluxia

 

Marluxia had more rep then Zexion. If they would follow either one, it would have been Marluxia.

Maybe you didnt read this thread. If you did... you probably wouldnt have posted that.

 

Hmm, the reason I said Xemnas was out and well, in a position that was not so good to him was because in some cut scenes there is evidence to show that Xemnas had gone either to sleep or was doing something compromising in the chamber, or at least Marluxia and Vexen believed so. In one scene Vexen approached Zexion about it and wanted to know what Xemnas was doing and tried to lure Zexion into it. Zexion wanted no part of it. It's then hinted in parts of CoM that Marluxia also knows about Xemnas to some degree and also was investigating things and that is the whole reason Marluxia was doing a bid for power. He did feel secure that Xemnas was in some vulnerable state and if he had the right tool (the Keyblade Master) he could win. He also had Namine. These scenes are in the KH2:FM and COM:RE stuff and are posted here on these forums in the fmvs. I'll go ahead and dig up which ones specific and also look up the actual scripts later if there needs to be more proof.

As for whether Marluxia was one of the -stronger- members...I really still do not see that he was. And no, it is not because of the pink hair and flowers and pink scythe. I would think he was weaker if he looked like Duke Nukem, because his demeanor was all bravado but when it came down to it, he was more of a person that was strong if he could use something else or strike you unaware. Also, Xemnas was definitely the Superior to them all in power. He had the power to change any of them into Dusks most likely. Axel also was not one of the most powerful and yet he did stand toe to toe with Marluxia and then Marluxia hid behind a girl and used it as a way to side track Axel and get Sora after Axel so he could exit stage left. He also had to use a huge Nobody to fight in the final battle. I really can't see that he was in the upper powered levels. The most powerful to me seemed to be Xemnas, Saix, Xaldin, Roxas and Xigbar. They (other than Roxas) also seemed to know the most and be the most efficient. The others had varying ability and I wouldn't place Marluxia on the bottom, but I think given the right circumstances, any of the remaining ones could have had the potential to take each other out. None of the Org were what I'd consider to be wussies. Marluxia's power over the others in Castle Oblivion seemed to be the point that Xemnas made him in charge so he had access to Replicas, the huge Nobody and control over the Castle itself. He also had Namine. He had all the tools to hold a dominance over the others and Vexen knew it when he was called on the carpet for challenging. Really, in the end, he had the advantage over the others just by these bonus factors and though I don't see him as necessarily weaker than the others who were at the Castle Oblivion, he was not really superior to them either without these bonuses.

As for Zexion being followed, it isn't in Zexion's nature. I really do not think with how his demeanor was that he cared to actually -lead- anything. He was more a person that liked his independence to research and do things and not be bothered with power more than that. He was brilliant but he never seemed to want to be over others as much as he wanted to ensure his own survival and his abilities to do what he wanted solo. He also seemed to get along well with Lexaeus, who I bet he'd rather have seen in charge because he had no real trust or liking of Vexen or Marluxia in the end.

 

Ah Repliku, we meet again!

Oh so you think Marluxia was weak???

Then can you explain how he could do this... That doesnt seem like all bravado too me. That is not a huge nobody to fight his final battle, thats all Marluxia. Sora defeated the nobody before that battle.

Yes, he would strike you unaware, which made him dangerous. He used his intelligence to equal power.

I said before, and I will say it again... Marluxia's key streanth was his inteligence.

So the fact that he "hid behind" Namine was actaully a sign of streanth, he played his wildcard, Sora, against the Organizations wildcard, Axel. Even Axel was like "So, you ended up being his puppet anyway."

The fact that Xemnas gave Marluxia all that authority only furthers the idea that Marluxia was powerful.

By the way, in case you missed my point... Intelligence = Power.

 

I did not say he was WEAK. I said he was not on par with Xemnas, Xigbar, Saix and Xaldin. He was, however, in the range of strength and mind, in the realms of power as Axel, Larxene, Lexaeus, Demyx, etc. There is nothing there that shows he has any more power by HIMSELF than each of them do. Any of those people could take one another in a fight and he's included. He showed nothing that would place him above the others in fighting or in brains.

Intelligence - There is -no- way Marluxia was -MORE- intelligent than any of the other Org members there. They were all very intellectual and had a lot of knowledge. There was not a single -stupid- Org member at the Castle Oblivion. Zexion was a genius and everyone knows that. Lexaeus was super smart and figuring out moves. Vexen was quirky and the mad scientist of the group but he was still very intelligent. Larxene was well read and intelligent, Axel was super smart etc. He did not have intelligence above those people at all. He was on par.

Power - There is nothing showing that he has MORE power than any of those members at the Castle Oblivion. He fought Axel and there is nothing showing Axel would lose. It seemed to me that the fight could go either way and this is why Marluxia used Namine. He could not take a risk that Axel may win. It would ruin plans. If he had so much power, when he drew his weapon on Vexen, he could have taken him out for being a -traitor- right there but instead he has Axel do it. I believe physically he was probably stronger than Vexen and Zexion but I do not see it with the others there and I know that with the right circumstances, Vexen and Zexion could defeat Marluxia just as easily as he could defeat them.

So then, if there is NOTHING that puts him above the others, why is he in charge? Because Xemnas placed him that way. I have some theories about it but nothing is canon told yet. He does have order to him to get things done and I think Xemnas did perhaps have an idea that some people were acting a bit less than trustworthy. Placing Marluxia in charge would be an insult to Vexen, Lexaeus and Zexion who were senior members and of the original 6. It may have been a test to see how loyal all of the Nobodies assigned there were. He may even have known that Marluxia and Vexen had knowledge they should not have and set this up to make them fight or just suffer with each other. Vexen probably assumed he would be in charge as he was higher in number, but it was stated by Nomura that number only reflects what order the Nobodies came into the Org, and not necessarily power or rank. The chairs were more for rank.

What's he get for being in charge? He gets control of the Castle Oblivion and can order the others to do things and they should not question his authoriteh. After all, obedience was one high thing that Xemnas was big on. He could probably control the lesser Nobodies there to include his big pal at the end. He could take projects away from others as he did with Riku Replica from Vexen. He probably also had Vexen make the other Replica of himself or had access to being able to do so. In the end, the power Xemnas gave him put him above the others and he also had control over Namine who could boost the Castle's power and do things. He had the highest cards in his hand. THIS is what seems to me to be where Marluxia gained power over the others and he was using it to play a coup.

So, for the last time, he's not weaker than the other Nobodies. He is on par. However, having been put in charge gave him authority, more power, and a position to plot to get rid of Vexen, Lexaeus and Zexion who would not cater to his plan in no way. If there is anyone who was underestimated in the end for brains etc, it was Axel; not Marluxia. This does not by any means mean that I am saying Marluxia was dumb. He was not. Just he was not smarter than everyone else there. There is nothing at all anywhere that reveals to me he had the upper hand in intellect or power when on his own but there is also nothing anywhere that shows he was weaker than any member there on their own either. That's the non-fan boy, non-hater opinion here pertaining to Marluxia. The evidence speaks for itself.

 

Then tell me what the hell is Marluxia's final form?

And why is his chair Xaldin status, even above Xigbar? You forget, Xemnas was not only big on obedience, he was big on power. So, if Marluxia wasnt obediant (he was a traitor after all) then that means he was powerful. Xemnas, in effect, showed it himself.

I would like to here your theory's. Even if your affraid to post them up for fear they would be shot down, PM me with them. I would really like to here it.

 

Marluxia would be the final boss, and the plot would be alot different. Its true that sora would be a slave, and yes, i think so too that sora would be a slave. also that other girl-the blonde org member, whats her anme?marluxia also would have her with her, since they both plotted and planned for that.
not a very organized organization, dont you think?

 

Marluxia's final form in CoM is he is joined with a Nobody to boost his own power. I'm not getting at why that's not being seen. It's not just himself. He's using something to raise his strength etc.

As for why is his seat as high as Xaldin's? The reason is because he was in charge of the Castle Oblivion. He was given a position of duty and status. It does not represent anything else other than who has Xemnas's favor and holds a position of importance to Xemnas at the time. The better the Org members do, the higher their seats. If they fail, the lower their seats, or if they have a falling out of sorts with Xemnas. It does not express power in a way. It expresses whether Xemnas likes you and what your responsibility and success rates are. That was explained in another post and is correct.

My theory on why Marluxia was put in charge is because Xemnas wanted to stir up things and make the Org off kilter that were stationed at the Castle. Vexen's nosing around might have gotten back to Xemnas somehow and he had the highest number out of the Org stationed there and also is one of the original 6. Putting Marluxia in charge would be a slap in the face to Vexen, which in CoM, Vexen voices his discontentment over and Marluxia draws his scythe on him. I think in the end it was a test of who was loyal and who was not and a way to get rid of traitors by causing some infighting. There still is nothing at all showing that Marluxia had more power than the other Org members there, or intellect. He didn't have less either, as the Org members all had strengths and weaknesses. Watching over the Castle Oblivion would seem to be something though that Xemnas would want and he may have been suspicious of Marluxia but playing a mind game. His choice also could be seen as a positive too in another way.

Larxene - she's a sadist. Not the best choice to put in power and also since she is female and Xemnas had a male superiority thing going on which Nomura himself states, she would not be in charge. Nomura said that initially Marluxia was to be a female but Xemnas would never place a female in charge so she's out on account of her gender even more than her nature memes.

Zexion - He doesn't care to be in charge. He's socially distant and would rather study and use intellect, examining things etc than to be put in charge of seeing over others. Also, his appearance as a teenager might make others test his right to that position.

Vexen - He's quirky and questionable as to how loyal he is. It is known through Ansem Reports (the real ones by DiZ Ansem) that he was -very- interested in the project Ansem was doing and also extremely interested in Xehanort. He knew things and was studying things that perhaps set him at odds with Xemnas and others of the upper 6. Despite his higher number than anyone there, his loyalty was seemingly more to his studies than it was to the Org.

Lexaeus - This guy had the most chance probably of being the leader other than Marluxia. However, he is a defender and is not a speaker. He may also not have wanted to be in charge and rather was a supportive type of person, stopping fights, squabbling etc. Though he had the potential to be a great leader for the job, it is perhaps something he did not want to do but liked the power to settle things and maintain order instead from a secondary leadership position.

Axel - Though intelligent, he is a wild card and Xemnas would know that. I also think he approached things in an unorthodox manner and he did not have the presence of seriousness that Marluxia possessed. Axel often comes off as unusual, extreme and seems to not want to show how smart he is, but rather play off he's of a certain stereotype to take advantage of people being blind to it. Therefore he's not a good choice and he had his job and took the things he did serious, but he was more of a follower and independent person by far than a leader.

So, that leaves Marluxia who shows he has arrogance, can take insults and come back with his own, has a solid presence, seems calm and calculated etc and can counter Vexen well because he probably was not so in favor at the time of the assignment. The other Org members were actually probably doing other duties and so they were not going to be assigned to what needed to be done. It was shown in one fmv that Vexen was assigned to get potential Org members because Xigbar was busy with other tasks and he considered it a menial task.

In the end, out of the choices for who would be best to lead the Castle Oblivion, if Marluxia was not a traitor, would be Marluxia because he wanted to lead and could be efficient whereas others were not either wanting it or their positions with the Org stances were questionable. It also makes sense that even if Marluxia was pondered to be a traitor that he could get the position if Xemnas wanted to keep things occupied with those who were sent to the Castle while the real missions were being undertaken by other Org members (Luxord, Xigbar, Xaldin). There is still really nothing to suggest Marluxia had more power than all of the other Org members assigned to Castle Oblivion but he did have what Xemnas wanted in personality to do the job, whether it was to stir up trouble there and occupy them or to actually watch the place and do what he should be doing.

 

This is what I posted before on it:

I've also never heard or read Marluxia or even Zexion saying any more than that, except just mentioning Xemnas a few times, Marluxia specifically to Vexen about how he was disobeying him, and in turn, disobeying the Superior, who gave him the job as the castle's Lord. So, yeah, it would be worth to post some quotes on how it hints that Xemnas was vulnerable around that time.

------

And that's it.

Though you have to give Marluxia the benefit of the doubt, he was placed in that job for a reason, and considering he was partly a newcomer, it's telling. If Marluxia wasn't as powerful as the rest of the members in the castle, Zexion, Lexaeus, or even Vexen, didn't need to do what they did on Riku to solve the betrayal problem. Sora wasn't even in complete control yet by Naminé, and it would've been a clean job if that was case to face him alone, instead of going through all that trouble. Yes, Marluxia is in charge, but if all the three (not to mention the apprentices) and Axel explained to the Superior the cause for his death (and depending if Larxene would've died), I'm sure he wouldn't have minded.

And while I did agree that Marluxia isn't all powerful as Axel went head to head with him without a problem, unlike Axel and Saïx (who he feared), the fight was cut short, and all Marluxia really did was block and throw his scythe in a black/pink wisped attack at Axel, which trembled from the force. In the end, if the fight would've continued, the winner wouldn't be Axel, in my opinion. I never said Marluxia was on top power as Xemnas, Xaldin, Roxas, or Saïx, but he was surely gifted to cause a impression, and I would believe he would be the closest in line in that rank next.

And almost everyone can agree, that the first final battle with Marluxia, where you actually fight him head to head, was much harder than he was when he hopped on his Nobody creature. That merely held his power back in my opinion, and I'm still not sure whether which one should've been first.

That, and I don't think Marluxia seems that type of person who carries a aura of arrogance, superiority, and confidence without backing it up.

I'm just saying you shouldn't ride on the "he's not that great" bandwagon just yet. You might get more than you expected in 358/2. And so will I. Who knows?

 

Actually I found Marluxia to be the easiest fight out of the Nobodies in the end, with both fights but that's just me. I thought he was a crappy end boss because I waltzed through both forms. Despite this fact and how some people feel the first form was more difficult, Sora had no problems with going against it. Also, it was a replica...but that's not so important. He says as he's standing outside the door that the power beyond it (which is 2nd form Marluxia) is great, so in the end we are supposed to know that the 2nd form is in fact the more powerful one which is boosted by the Nobody he uses. When he first faced Marluxia, he didn't really comment on power in any such way at all.

Also, once again, I must state that I am not implying he was -weak-. I just said that he had advantages that put him over his companions that were from being in charge of the castle. ALL of the Nobodies there were pretty powerful. There were none there that were pushovers. His presence and aura of arrogance as you say, and superiority complex made him seem stronger than some others, but really, I see nowhere that he's more powerful than the other Org members there who actually seemed just as deadly. I think it does the other Org members a disservice to say that he was more powerful when they were the ones that were fighting out front and doing a lot and were pretty devastating in their own rights. Here are some ways to show really that the Org never feared Marluxia himself or had that much respect for him despite his aura of arrogance etc. They in fact feared the Superior.

Meanwhile, Vexen also knows that they are using Sora but for what...hmm.

It seems though that Vexen thinks Sora will be used for the purpose of the Organization and the three assumed in this and Reverse Rebirth that he would turn over Sora, but they come to realize rather quickly that's not true.

Now, where does Vexen actually -fear- Marluxia? He does not. No one did. And he had the greatest risk of needing to fear as they were at odds. He only fears once Marluxia says he's going to narc on him and that treason is a capital crime. This shows that his position with being holder of the castle makes him more important but that he's not really above the others in power necessarily, just authority and the power that authority grants him.

Now does Axel fear Marluxia?

It doesn't seem so. He pretty well spoke that he was going to kill the 'traitor' and we all know in the end he meant Marluxia, so Marluxia could not take the order back. Again, it seems that it is power of the castle and position bestowed on him by Xemnas that let him have this influence. No one actually seems to really fear -him- but instead, the Superior. Now, as for needing Riku....

Vexen before he's cut down by Axel. He doesn't seem to even fear Marluxia again, and this is where in RR they do suspect Marluxia a traitor and so he pretty well tells Sora he's in a trap. Unfortunately, Marluxia also knows that Vexen knows too much and he also ratted out things about Roxas so he could use that to make the act considered treasonous. Fortunately, (or unfortunately) Sora is too daft to get the info but eh, it was more judgement on Vexen and death by being caught in a compromised weak position that took him down than fearing Marluxia again.

Sora is obviously part of Marluxia's plan so this is why again, the other side needed Riku. Keyblades hurt Nobodies as they do other Darkness beings. Also, if simply letting Namine go was well, the time when the plan was toast...

I mean seriously...the words say it all. Marluxia isn't weaker than the other Org members but he knows he can't possibly destroy them without the Keyblade. He -has- to have it.

Here's the lines between Axel and Marluxia that show this plan and well Sora -has- to be used to overthrow the Org.

So his plan is to use Sora...so yeah, again, where is this vaunted power that is above the other Org members?

He then of course dark portals away. He only really had to deal with Axel. After all, Vexen is dead. Lexaeus is also dead by this time and later Axel goes to speak with Zexion after his battle with Sora. So he couldn't face Axel? There's a good chance he could have won Axel, but it seems that it obviously was not that -great- of a chance or he'd have done something other than hiding behind a girl. After all, Axel trashed his whole plan. Convenient he gets the 'Keyblade' master to do it. I think this is the point with Marluxia. He's more powerful bossing people around and manipulating, doing things behind people's backs etc than he is at being upfront. It doesn't make him weaker but really, until he has nothing left to lose, he was just manipulating others, etc.

In RR, they comment about why Riku was needed right here. He was a counter to Sora. Also, Lexaeus makes a comment that suggests Vexen may have been more powerful than Marluxia.

So, there's the reason for Riku. It is not to deal against Marluxia at all. It is to deal with not wanting to get Keybladed to death. It all makes perfect sense to me. Also, as I have said now, I am not trying to convince people Marluxia was -WEAKER- than the other members of the Org there. What I am saying is that he was not really more powerful either. He had a higher position in chair status by what his purpose was as keeper of the Castle Oblivion while Xemnas was gone and the other Org members were doing their thing. No one actually feared Marluxia or were worried about him at all, but for his -PLAN-. If I had a choice of who I'd pick to fight between Marluxia and Sora...yeah, I'm going to go beat on Marluxia. It's clear that Riku and Sora were the most powerful beings in the castle and everyone came to know that. Axel knew it and he just sat back watching it all fall apart.

 

Yeah, I guess I can see Zexion as it. I think maybe Luxord or Xigbar. Or Vexen or Saix, since he's the right hand man of Xemnas. Not Marluxia.

 

*Looks at *TwilightNight* and Repliku's posts... then backs away slowly*

This is out of my league... I'm backing out of this one.

I believe Marluxia is stronger than most though... maybe not Xemnas strong... but pretty strong.

 

Then that's simply the game play's fault. If it was suppose to be more powerful, than they should've worked on making it powerful, because that's just inconsistency if it was suppose to be strong, and the player doesn't feel it. And the things is, Riku mentioned that the power coming from beyond is great, yet the replica came from Marluxia himself. It flows with the fact of Xemnas being able to turn members into dusks. It's his own essence and power, and that's enough for me. It doesn't matter if it's a differen entity, is still part of Marluxia and he's the one that created its existence.

I also never implied that he was that powerful either, what I said was, that he had to hold over some type of strength to get the position of where he is at now. Unless Xemnas suspected Marluxia directly of planning betrayal (in which we cannot prove or disprove), I don't see why else would they place him in charge of a castle. When he was new. When he hasn't been there for that long and got chosen over veterans. That's what I'm trying to say. Throughout the game, the expression I got, whether it contrasts with yours, that's not the problem, is that they showed Marluxia to have a certain dangerous energy and power. Every attack he did, and every move he made, was made to appear serious. The attack he did on Axel, his summoning of his scythe, the way he flows, the way he disappears suddenly, how he led Sora to Castle Oblivion, the way he died. I'm sorry, but if it's not obvious that the whole point of those factors was to show the players that this man isn't one to take lightly, is all you.

As for the rest, I also do not understand why the members would 'fear' him. Wait. Did I even mention anything about fear? *checks posts* Okay, no, I didn't, fine. I'm not even going to argue about Axel, because I know the redhead didn't fear him, and I never disagreed or argued against that, especially when before I was highlighting it thoroughly. I even said, and you can requote me on this, that Axel and Marluxia's power levels aren't too atrociously apart on what that short battle they had showed (keep in mind, I'm talking about the short battle). I don't know what point you're trying to make to me for something I already know. Axel is Axel, man. Yet, is also good to point out that Marluxia was just as sure of himself, and when fighting, you could see a close-up where he's actually grinning. It's hard to tell what Marluxia is thinking, or what he thought when summoning Naminé to him, while Axel said it to be one thing in his view, it could be a whole other different reason.

Also, he didn't only have to take care of Axel by that point. Is good to note that Marluxia sensed Sora coming while they were in the midst of fighting. Combined with his plan foiled, and with the fact that Axel could easily twist words around and make Sora against him, or simply that Sora is hunting him down and Axel might join him, Marluxia took the initiative (He isn't stupid. A Keyblade, as we all know, on a Organization is a pretty drastic thing to deal with, hence, why he pursued it, but then have to deal with two people? Not even Xaldin or Xigbar dealt well with the Keyblade, who you say, and I say, is among the strongest. Then to have a little extra amo on the side? The tides were against him). That's why he wasn't surprised when Sora came in, he was prepared, so, he made Sora go against Axel instead. That way, he took one problem down at a time, and he went to face Sora alone in the end. It also makes it understandable and can explain why he was chuckling and being so smug about getting Naminé to him. Not even when Axel mentioned about the "cower behind a girl" (mind you, I don't think he said this in Re: CoM), it didn't bother him.

As arrogant and self-confident as Marluxia presented himself, I doubt he will make himself look bad by appearing a coward. I personally think he knew what he was doing.

As for Vexen, is not the words, is his expressions. I'm very sure no one missed the look on his face when Marluxia pointed the end of his scythe to his face, and this was before he mentioned Xemnas. He stood up for himself, but it was blatant Marluxia wasn't going to kill him then (and I admit, you have to give credit to Vexen in this part). When Vexen and Sora battled, his side was with Zexion and Lexaeus, he was weak, and he perhaps knew that there wasn't much he could do anymore (remember, he was already threatened by Marluxia reporting Xemnas of his "failure", and this was a chance to prove himself and avoid that), so, now that Sora was here, and he lost, why not show him and reveal the truth so he will snap back out of Marluxia using him? Why not take the chance now? That's what he did, but before he could reveal anything more, we know what happens. This is not out of fear or not fear, this is simply taking a hold of a chance and grasp it.

What I don't understand is where you are going with this overpowered thought that you seem to have in your mind? My argument is that Marluxia might've shown gifted strength from others that must have impressed, but you're exceeding it to another level, the way I read it. Marluxia's plan was to overtake the Organization. He needed extra help to take care of that. Of course, he's going to need it, of course he's going to need the wielder of the Keyblade. I don't think fighting ten members (if it comes down to it) by himself (let's say, as strong as he is or how I'm making it to be) is possible. The only one who can come unharm out of that is Xemnas himself. Not even Xaldin. Xigbar. Saïx, in my opinion, can be capable of that feat.

That's the thing. Is good to show your strength when one vs. one, but when it becomes three vs. one, or two vs. one, it gets to the point where is extra power to deal with. I think it fits for all Org. members, again, except, Xemnas. While Marluxia is strong, he's not all powerful to take one more than he can handle like a breeze. As you said yourself, every member is strong, aren't they? He knew he needed the help, so he thought of a plan to obtain it.

It seems to me that while Zexion and the rest are suspecting Marluxia, as they should, while Riku can be used to counter Sora, Zexion has it in his mind that just because Riku has the essence of their Superior, that they have it in their hands, and will be untouchable. We all know Riku's story and the consequences it might have for him, especially to go against Sora (I'm not going to mention which one is stronger as that isn't the point in this whole thing, is debatable anyway, but it is something to think about. Am I going to have to expect a few paragraphs on this just for mentioning it?). It would've been a interesting battle, I'd say, the outcome, I can't predict. Anyway...

I don't see in that quote where Lexaeus says that Vexen may have been more powerful than Marluxia. Is well known Sora exceeds everyone's strength, and while I also don't agree that Vexen is as weak as people place him to be (poor guy...seriously), this is simply taking your interpretation on the line. Is vague and it can be perceived differently. It doesn't stand on its own.

 

Sora mentions the power beyond the door is great. Not Riku Replica. Also, that makes no sense that he -created- it so it makes him more powerful. How many things did Vexen create? Vexen also didn't use any creations, nor did anyone else, when fighting Sora. They all went mano-a-mano with the Keyblader. Marluxia used a cheater thing. It still does not prove Marluxia was more powerful than the other Org members at all. It still supports what I am saying and truly I'm not sure why you are arguing it. He used leverage over other Org members by being able to have control of the Castle and Namine. He himself was average with the rest of the Org there.

That pretty well says there that it's the real Marluxia and his Nobody pal. What's the problem here?

He didn't need strength. He needed the right personality and to accomplish missions successfully and to be placed by the Superior as he wanted. What? What dangerous energy and power? ALL of the Org showed mysterious dangerous energy and power. Hell, Larxene moved fast enough to hit Sora straight off and wound him and the Riku Replica too and she was physically strong. Lexaeus smacked Riku into a wall after he had been defeated. I'm not seeing how Marluxia's powers were displayed as more potent than the others. Their abilities were actually doing things that hurt the good guys and made me say 'damn!' Also, Namine lured Sora to the castle. Marluxia caught her doing so and made her lure him the rest of the way. In other words, he was doing nothing but bossing her to do what she wanted to, just in his way.

Also, I never said to take Marluxia lightly. The point is that NONE of the Org members there should have been taken lightly. He isn't that incredible of a figure whether he has pink hair, flowers and a pretty scythe or not. Not when compared to his neighbor Nobodies. They all could kick butt. One on one, he would not be the victor all the time, amongst just those at the Castle Oblivion. Note, I am leaving the others out here because it isn't even important. He's tough, but any of them were tough and given the right circumstances, any of them one on one could have won. His advantage PURELY was because he had favor with Xemnas. Show me otherwise instead of just saying stuff.

No, you didn't say they feared him. The point was they did not really have that genuine an amount of care at all for Marluxia. For someone who's supposed to be soOOo dangerous, they simply don't have any regard for it. However, Xemnas...that makes people fear and have respect. That is the deal. He did not have anything higher than the others except his position as keeper of the castle and Namine and really everyone knew it. If someone like Xaldin or Saix had been in charge, there would have been no arguing with the guy. They would know that doing so would be costly and those two wouldn't wait around to narc to ol' Xemmy. The lack of respect and concern shows he's not someone any of them considered above them but with his responsibility. Power-wise, it's not like they assumed they could take him, but they also had nothing to worry about either. If he's so much more powerful than those there, they'd have at least felt something to the necessity of their survival as Axel did with Saix in KH2. It's just not there. It's another thing to prove the issue of people trying to say he's a higher powered Nobody than those others. AGAIN, it doesn't make him weaker.

Uhh...I'm confused here what your point is. He used a girl to hide behind to get rid of Axel by tattling to Sora that Axel was going to go through Namine to get at him. It's a classic villain ploy. He knew what he was doing. He did not want to face Axel and could have Sora get rid of him because it is a fight he may have lost or won. Of course he was smug. He knew that Sora would fight Axel because Sora always protects the wussy girls. He also knew Axel would possibly actually do the act of attack. So what if it's strategically planned? He still hid behind a girl to get what he wanted because Keyblades hurt worse than Marluxia could.

Vexen's expressions were always weird but the point is what the words say in the script dialog. Vexen's expressions were shock at the audacity of Marluxia to threaten him. The words say it all. Vexen countered and really, the only holding card that would make Vexen bow to the demands was Marluxia narcing on him that he was failing to Xemnas. There's nothing that Marluxia had over Vexen at all other than this. Period.

The point is that you are trying to place Marluxia as higher than the other members there at the Castle and I just do not see him as being weaker or stronger without the power of the Castle and having Namine and the script itself also agrees with this. There is NOTHING showing that Marluxia one on one compared to others is superior on his own, nor weaker. Keep in mind, I'm speaking of those in the Castle. Not those out doing actual work for the Org. One on one, he's not superior. A fight between any of them could go either way.

The point is that Lexaeus says it about he is more powerful than Vexen and would be Marluxia's puppet. Why didnt' he say he's more powerful than Marluxia? Because no one regarded that Marluxia was actually more powerful than Vexen. It's a stretch and I admit it, but it is part of the script too.

In the end, you are taking what I am saying wrong and the only point I was trying to declare was what the story itself pretty well shows. People are always saying either Marluxia is uber strong and above the other Org members at just below Xemnas's level or they try to say he's an ultimate puss and the weakest of the Org. In a neutral stance, I can't see he's either of those. I think it's fanboyish to say he's uber ultimate and could take on the Org members one on one and defeat them at the castle, and I also think it's hater material to say he sucks and should be the lowest rank. His 'power' of influence, fact he could speak well, had a prominent ego, acted out a leadership role were great traits to put him in charge whether to use him or to not use him for dubious reasons. If he did anything else utterly amazing, maybe we'll see it in 358/2 Days but maybe not since it is about Roxas.

As far as I can tell, it's like having a team of kids playing a baseball game and you decide to make one captain because he plays by the rules, looks good and can speak well and you feel he's not going to be doing something stupid while you are taking care of other business, and he wants the job. It doesn't mean the other kids aren't just as good or some aren't even better at certain things than that person is.

What I'm confused about is you are going at me and yet you said this before.

I did agree he is smart and strong. I don't really find him intimidating but he has a strong aura of arrogance and self confidence. We aren't differing that much in opinion here. I just don't place him in the top 5. You do. We both agree he's not of the absolute strongest or weakest. So I'll just concede to stop bothering looking up more because it feels like a lame argument that you leapt on me for and it makes no sense.

 

Didn't Riku recognize Marluxia's power when Marluxia died...

He said, "Another sent is gone... this time its a big one."

I never heard him say that when, Lex, Zex, Larx, or Vex. Only when Marluxia dies.

This proves that Marluxia does have some edge over the others... because it is explained, "That was the Lord of this castle."

Marluxia has a "bigger" dark sent than the others. So in this aspect... he is more powerful.


This is evidence that he was more than just another Org member, he was special in some way.