Kingdom Hearts II Idea Concerning the Three 'Knights'

This is one of the reasons that I actually joined this, to share you an idea I've just recently thought of concerning the mysterious armored figures at the end. Now I know that everyone and their grandmother is putting out theories nowadays, so please don't throw anything at me just yet, this is just my two cents on the subject.

Recently, I was reading a thread on another site that I 'lurk' at, and it said that the new Kingdom Hearts game would occur in the past and future at different points in the game, so that got me thinking. Why would Nomura do this? Then I went and watched the secret ending to KH2 on YouTube and I began to think: what if...what if the knights represent the past, present, and future? This also goes along with the assumption that knights aren't the 'good' guys. Heck, for all we know, they might actually be the bad guys.

Now, there may be some conflicting ideas with this: 1) the knights might be the Chasers (I've seen this many a time before, and I'm not sure where people got this from) or 2) they might be connected to current Keyblader-wielders.

Keep in mind, this is all an idea that doesn't really have much factual basis to it (it's all guess-work). And now I thought to myself: Nomura introduces the 'Knights,' and then he states that the game will occur in different time periods, what's up with that?

I believe that, like I said before, the knights all come from different time periods (though I have no idea who comes from where). So far, all we know about the 'Keyblade War' is...that a lot of Keyblade-wielders died (judging by the amount of weapons at the 'crossroads' section). That's it. So...could it be plausible that it not only takes place in the present, but in the past *and* the future as well?

Now, some might point out that if they're all new characters, how could the middle one be from the present? Well, who says that Sora and Riku (I'm not counting Kairi because we're not really sure if she keeps the Keyblade given to her or not) are the only ones who can wield them right now? The KH universe is a very big place from what we've seen, perhaps one of these knights is one that exists already. This also could explain how in that apparent cutscene (this is from what I've heard, mind you, not totally sure) where Xigbar (I believe) has a small chat with one of the knights. Does that means that the knights are 'evil'? Well, we know that Org. XIII weren't the nicest of people, so perhaps they have bad tendencies.

But then, this raises the question: how do they pick up the Kingdom Key, the Way to Dawn, and the last, unnamed Keyblade? More speculation: who's to say that Keyblade-wielders can't fall into darkness themselves? Who's to say that Keyblades can't join them, going to the 'dark side'? If they're connected to the heart, this may explain their rusty, and battle-worn looks, perhaps it reflects the hearts of the knights: possibly corrupted. Whilst Sora's and Riku's look newer and sleeker.

Where is this taking place? Your guess is as good as mine. Though I like to think that wherever this is, it's...a place *beyond* time, somewhere where all of the Keyblades of the past, present, and future will eventually come to rest. Is this somewhere within Kingdom Hearts itself? It's a very odd idea but...you never know.

And so that leaves us with the odd figure in the sandstorm at the end, who is he/she? Now if you'll notice one of the phrases at the end 'Memory of Xehanort'...well, we know that he used to play on the right team before he eventually became a Nobody/Heartless, and that Ansem found him...and it appears the place that we see is some sort of 'graveyard,' so maybe he used to be a 'caretaker' of sorts in this place?

I know all of this is speculation with no real factual basis (probably the worst way to pose a theory) and probably sounds like something out of a fan fic, but I just had to get that out there to the rest of the KH fandom, let me know what you think about it.

Please though, no flames on it, just constructive criticism, thank you. :)

 

wow...many the nights we have wondered about this.... the past you were talking about ( the game takes place in the past, maybe) probably has something to do with xehanort's lost memories....maybe he gets them back...when you defeat xemnas' final form, he doesn't say anything about riku, mickey, or sora. he says "cursed keyblade", probably because the keyblade defeats him. and in secret ending , ansem report 0 was all about keyblades. if riku, sora, mickey, ansem(when possesing riku), kairi, roxas, and the 3 knights all had keyblades, than it is obviously not a "rare" weapon. speaking of which, where DID riku get kairi's keyblade? and if riku returned to his normal appearence when DiZ's machine blew up, maybe DiZ didn't die, but is somewhere else.

One more thing....WHERE THE HECK DID YEN SID AND THE FAIRIES GO?

 

Hold up! You know what Ansem report 0 says!?! Forgive me for asking, but how? Did you take the time to read it from the secret ending?
Nice thread by the way HeartlessNobody!
Knowing Nomura's way of doing things, there's probably some seriously deep symbolism in his saying of the secret ending's setting is in the past and the future. The idea I have for this is based on the symbolism in the game, but I really can't explain it in a thread like this due to the length. I really don't want to bore you. :(

 

well, wasn't ansem report 0 kinda obvious? it said the words right on the screen. plus, there is a site which has all of that writing written out and all of the major scenes of the ending. so...yeah, i know what it says.

 

Those are some very interesting thoughts, Shadow Tactician! :)

I'll try to give you my thoughts on the subjects.

"Xemnas Regaining His Memories": It would probably stand to reason that, yes, Xemnas got all of his memories back at that point in time, and the question is: what does this say for other Nobodies, is it possible that they get their memories of being human back too?

"The Keyblade wasn't/isn't a rare weapon": This is a spot-on observation, since we did see all of those Keyblades. So if this place is in the past/future, this might even further support the idea that it's somewhere beyond time. So I suppose we're to assume that it isn't common in the 'now,' the present, but it will/was once a upon a time.

"Where did Riku get the extra Keyblade?": You know, I always just sort of figured that he could have two, like Sora can, but I'm interested to see what your opinion on the subject is.

"Is DiZ/Ansem dead?": You know...I don't think I have an answer for this one, I seriously never considered it until you brought it up. Who knows? You might be right, DiZ/Ansem might be still alive somewhere, albeit as something...different perhaps? If the Heartless are the heart, and the Nobodies are the body and soul, where does that the leave the mind?

Thanks, Twilight'sBringing. :) I actually couldn't read the text either, so you and I are in the same boat. And I'd like to hear about your time symbolism theory! Sounds pretty interesting (though I'm not sure you can post a totally separate idea in a 'main' thread, if not, could you PM me?)

 

well, for ansme report 0, the words in the background didn't matter. you've all seen the english secret ending right?

Ansme Report 0

umm...i forget what the beginning and middle was but i remeber the last part.

"i must know what this keyblade is: a key unlocks doors"

oh, and another thing....in the giant field of keyblades, me and my friends got a picture of the different angles. some keyblades in the field are mutiples of sora's. i saw wishing star, fenrir, and i think a few others in the giant field. it might have some significance.

 

Have you read the Dark is Rising series? The same kind of thing happens in that. They fight the Dark (seriously, that's what the enemy is called int the books) during both the time of King Arthur and during the 80s in England. I'm kinda liking that idea.

Anyways, yeah, by now it doesn't really seem that special to be a wielder of the keyblade. If Kairi and Xehanort can get one, anyone can. I am actually surprised that nobody else thinks that the Destiny Trio and Mickey are the only ones with keyblades. I like where you're going with the reflection of their hearts, though.

*SUDDEN IDEA!!!* Wow, random idea just as I was typing this. The female armoured figure picks up Mickey's keyblade, right? And most people consider this armoured unknown to be related somehow to Kairi. (I personally think she's simply connected to the Princesses of the Heart) Well, Kairi's keyblade has a gold shaft, much like Mickey's, right? Perhaps the keyblades are all originally from Kingdom, Way to Dawn, and Mickey's, and Kairi's was just Mickey's with a new keychain. They do never show Kairi and Mickey with their keyblades at the same time...

Okay, now I'm just ranting, so I'll stop. I like where this is going, though.

 

Based on this thread I've gotten an idea from the original post: If his ideas are true, each knight may not represent the three time periods, but the three crossroads in which they have taken if they left each other based on either the fact that they decided to leave each other being freinds, or the possibility that they (being the three surviving knights of the keyblade war) had been from seperate armys in the war, had taken their own paths. ( I have more, but I cant type them all now sorry.)

Update 1: Aditionally the phrase at the end of the vid stating: "Everything is born..Because of the Slumber." most likley means that because of soras sleep caused the creation of a new world, or ( this may work with original theory in first post) Soras slumber causes the three warriors based on time to work together and to stop a certain event that leads to said war in their diffrent time periods, maybe one war intwind through all three time periods, or three separate events, of course this part that ive just wrote isonly for the support of the threads original post allowing for its having a slightly higher amount of depth. (again, I will post more later based on any added info I find.)

Update 2: Sora and crew may not make an apearence in the new KHIII because of Sora sealing the promise he made with Kairi. ( He give back the oath keeper star-charm that Kairi gave to him in the first game. Kairi told him to bring it back to her

 

I've never actually read the series, but it sounds highly interesting, I'll be sure to try to get it from a bookstore or some place else! :)

Yeah, that's what I was trying to allude to: that it's highly probable that there are other, unknown Keyblade-wielders out there (could this even be what King Mickey's letter was about...? The discovery of another wielder? Perhaps this is even one of our knights)

Hm...that's a very good point, though I'm not totally sure I'd accept that. For one, just because we don't see them at the same time, doesn't mean that they don't individually own one. Roxas could wield two, so I think it would stand to reason that Riku could also. I'm not sure though, I could be wrong.

Thanks for contributing to the thread! I enjoyed giving your thoughts responses, let me know what you think.

Hm...you know, I'd like to add something to this, perhaps you agree with me. Okay, let's say I'm wrong and that they aren't from different time periods, but, like you said, different factions from when they were in the war. Let's look at it, alluding to my time period theory. From Kairi's grandmother's story, it would stand to reason that it seemed extremely prosperous, and, well more aligned with the 'light' than the present, this could represent a group perhaps that wants to support a peace between realms.

Now moving onto the 'present,' the present seems to be in constant flux over what side will dominate the other; there seems to be no end, and one could call this 'neutrality' or perhaps, more accurately, 'twilight' (a sort of in-between state between good and evil). The one of the knights of the group could be fighting to try to keep peace between the other two sides.

And lastly, the 'future.' Let's assume this: the darkness eventually wins at some point, either due to inexperienced Keyblade-wielders against the Nobodies and Heartless, or by something else, maybe no new wielders appeared; this helps the universe fall into disarray. The third participants may be fighting for a constant war, a never ending one, with good.

I think I actually believe that it's somewhere within Kingdom Hearts itself, look at it this way. We all know that hearts originate from within it, and if a heart is good, a Keyblade is awarded to the person for their righteousness. Though it's not really clear what happens when the wielder dies. So...is this the place where they go? A sort of mass grave where all the weapons are kept, and will be? Just some food for thought.

Also, I think to think that 'birth by sleep' is perhaps a literal statement, not an allusion to something. I believe that this could actually refer to the rifts between worlds, or perhaps the ending movie is set even before the worlds split off from one another.

Thanks, Zeron Strife. :) And you actually got me thinking about something: is it possible that this is what's happening during Sora's slumber after CoM? Kingdom Hearts '3' could actually be set after Chain of Memories, but before Kingdom Hearts II, maybe the knights have been brought together to try to save the worlds from falling into war (this does not explain the 'Keyblade' part of the title though), since Sora was incapacitated.

Hrm...I'm not exactly sure what that has to do with it though. Unless that means that Sora is going to stay with Kairi on Destiny Islands?

 

Hmm, it makes alot of sense.

So, is it that they're from the past the present and the future at the same time or is it that you go back and forth in the game from the past to the future and back to the present?

 

Well...I'm not actually sure on this part. But, if you ask me, I think that perhaps it might be that there might be parts where you 'visit' different time periods, besides the present. But that's just a guess.

 

I was thinking about that a while back
that like you could go through different time periods and whatnot


although my idea is different that yours

it's kinda of stupid and i have not thought about it alot
so it's not really a theory but more like a idea

i really like your idea though and i think that it would be really cool

 

Haylo. I am sure that what tet means by future and present is that these three knights picked these keyblades up a long time ago, and Sora Mickey and Riku will come and pick them up again.

 

Perhaps...and for all I know, I'm wrong about all of this. But, however, this does not exactly address WHY the knights are there; nor does your statement answer as to why they look battle worn (if this is indeed in the past) and why they look brand new in the first Kingdom Hearts.

 

Toothpaste. Polishes metal real well. :D

 

Toothpaste? Blah. I hear vaseline is all the rage these days. :P

 

Remember namura said there connected to someone we already know, maybe rikus family or Kairi's family.

 

i think that the 3 knights at the crossroads in the video is in the future, for some reason. if those keyblade's are rusted and worn, it could mean that they haven't been used for a while, like the threat of the nobodies and heartless was over. after all, sora thought the heartless were gone at the end of kh1, but they still came back. in the end of kh2, they never said that the war was over.

 

The greatest theory

In Youtube.com, there is a video of the intro to KHII backwards. If you listen carefully in the part where Roxas talks, it sounds like he says, "Yum, dessert.":D

But then it gets serious, "As the Seeker now went around, 'Meager rights', I guess they're meant for all. They're meant for all, f*ck those meager rights."

I bet that this is a secret the Nomura put in (except the part with "Yum, dessert and Roxas swearing :D ). I've got a few things to say about the "Meager rights" part. Have you noticed that the armored guys have an "M" on their chest? Maybe that stands for "Meager". Meager means "not enough", which makes sense in KH. The "rights" are probably talking about the armored guys' ability to wield Keyblades freely (as they are seen walking in a dessert full of Keyblades that look like they are free to take). Nomura says in an interview that the secret movie is set sometime in the past. Roxas is probably saying that anyone should have the right to freely wield Keyblades like the Meagers, because, in the Organization, Roxas might be thinking the same as Sora, "Xemnas is bad because he is messing up the worlds only because he needs hearts, and Sora is one of the only Keyblade wielders and is caring only for him and not anyone else who does not wield a Keyblade." So Roxas is saying that if anyone else had Keyblades, then the worlds wouldn't be in so much danger of, not only the Organization, but the Heartless as well. But I think that that after the "Keyblade War" finished, the Keyblades were only entrusted to people with strong hearts and Meagers, and Roxas wants that to change for some reason even I don't know.

Now, the "Seeker" is probably the first Meager we see in the secret movie. And he "went around" possibly to find Sora and somehow make the Keyblade right meant for all. And since we now know that Sora can fight with the Seeker in KHII:FM+, maybe after going around, the Seeker finally caught up with Sora. And the reason for fighting Sora is probably a test for him to find out how aggresive he can be and see if Keyblades really can be used by other people without strong hearts.

This is just my theory, but it makes a LOT of sense. From now on, I'll call the armored guys "Meagers". What do you guys think of this?

 

Hm...after reading what you've had to save, Zeftnon, I'd like to see that video, do you know of the link to it on YouTube?

This actually makes me think of the knights now as some sort of...law enforcement. Perhaps they're trying to keep the ability of wielding Keyblades to those who're few?

You know...that's a very well thought out explanation. :D And I think you actually may be onto something here. I'll have to rewatch the video though, because I can't recall the knights have 'm's on their chest plates. And Roxas' idea is probably right, I mean, if everyone on different worlds had Keyblades, then no one would be in any real danger (okay, that'd put Sora out of a job, but I guess you've got to crack a few eggs to make an omelet, right?)

Hm...okay, then that differs from my idea few posts above, but I have to interject something: the new secret boss we fight in KH2: FM+ is not colored the same way as the first knight we see. So think you might be a little off base here.

I actually like it, and I think that it's probable that this will happen in the next game, though the extent of your guesses is unknown to me, I feel that this will probably be proven right.

You know...I just had a recent thought: if this is indeed in the past, then couldn't we think that perhaps Sora, Riku, and Kairi are just reincarnations of the knights we see? We all know that hearts return to Kingdom Hearts (even the ones Heartless steal), so I think that some element of reincarnation must be involved, I believe it was even stated before that Kingdom Hearts is a akin to a recycling plant, or something.

This might also be true too, and would make some sense, at least on the surface. But I think that Keyblades probably 'disappear' if their owners choose them to. Then again, if you're right, we don't know how far into the future this is. 50 years? 100 years? 700? It's impossible to tell. So the gang, as we know them, could actually be dead around this time. And, like I said before, maybe this 'Sunset Horizons' (I believe this is what it's being called right now), is where the Keyblades will all come to rest, at some point or another.