I really must know the answer to this important mathematical question

Discussion in 'The Spam Zone' started by What?, Aug 8, 2012.

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  1. Arch Mana Knight

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    The only time you compare infinity to another infinity is when you're checking to see which infinity grows faster. x^2 as x approaches infinity is much less than x! as x approaches infinity. Where the "!" is a factorial.
     
    Arch, Aug 9, 2012
    Arch, Aug 9, 2012
    #81

  2. Makaze Some kind of mercenary

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    But again, isn't the move from x = 1 to x = 2 an approach towards infinity?​
     
    Makaze, Aug 9, 2012
    Makaze, Aug 9, 2012
    #82

  3. Arch Mana Knight

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    Yes, but that's like having y=x where x approaches infinity. There's other ways to write it but what really matters is what grows faster. x is raised to the first power and therefore grows slower than something like x^2. Taking the derivative proves that. ...But this is something pointless to prove to you since I'm certain you already know which approaches infinity faster. It's basic calculus.

    Now I'm starting to question the nature of your question. Are you just saying that increasing x by 1 will get it to infinity if you continuously add 1? That's...a little basic isn't it?
     
    Arch, Aug 9, 2012
    Arch, Aug 9, 2012
    #83

  4. Makaze Some kind of mercenary

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    No, I am saying that if you add one to it, and stop adding, it has approached infinity. It has gone through a change and moved closer to infinity.

    I am not understanding the difference between an increase in a number and an approach to infinity, and thus why it is practical to assert that infinity can be approached. From my perspective, 1 and 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 are equally close to infinity. They are not approaching it at all because it is unreachable, or undefined. You can't approach a target if you don't know what it is.

    I suppose I am trying to express that it seems like a meaningless concept. An increase in a number is an approach to infinity, and a decrease is an approach to zero. Why is that significant?    ​
     
    Makaze, Aug 9, 2012
    Makaze, Aug 9, 2012
    #84

  5. Arch Mana Knight

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    Oh! I see what you mean. I get your confusion(annoyance?) with this. It's just one of those things you're not supposed to think too hard about. Yes, infinity is just a concept. It's not a number which can be reached. This is the reason why in an equation you never EVER write "x=infinity" unless a limit has been attached to it first. A limit just implies that whatever you're looking at increases to the point where all other numbers are insignificantly small compared to it. It has reached a point where you can say it is infinity even if it never reaches it(as infinity is not a number).

    When looking at things that increase without bound, all you care about is the rate of increase(derivative...assuming it has one). Anything that increases takes an "approach" towards infinity but you only look at it that way if there are no boundaries.
     
    Arch, Aug 9, 2012
    Arch, Aug 9, 2012
    #85

  6. Makaze Some kind of mercenary

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    I was also having trouble with the "insignificantly small" bit, because I don't see why it would become insignificant. Bothers me to no end. Hence, the thread.​
     
    Makaze, Aug 9, 2012
    Makaze, Aug 9, 2012
    #86

  7. Arch Mana Knight

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    It comes up a lot in practical applications. Things like this are pretty annoying without anything to apply it to(hence why I double major in math and physics). A lot of things are ignored if a number is three orders larger than another. (Like 1000 compared with 1). Ultra-relativistic equations in physics are an example. You just drop a term in an equation to make life easier on yourself. Mathematicians and physicists are lazy, not masochists. ...Well, most of them anyways. XD
     
    Arch, Aug 9, 2012
    Arch, Aug 9, 2012
    #87

  8. Makaze Some kind of mercenary

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    The perfectionist in me is rolling over in her grave.

    I guess that explains why Kubo didn't want to explain.    ​
     
    Makaze, Aug 9, 2012
    Makaze, Aug 9, 2012
    #88

  9. Mixt The dude that does the thing

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    Brain fried from a conference today, but looking back over the thread I realized that either you were changing the subject a lot or we were just communicating badly. I would talk about 10^x and you would come back with comments about repeating single digit decimals (.11111...) And while those numbers do exist in that expression I think it is more likely that you never migrated from the greater topic to discuss the subtopic (or got really lost on the point of the subtopic)
     
    Mixt, Aug 10, 2012
    Mixt, Aug 10, 2012
    #89

  10. Railos Hollow Bastion Committee

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    I would say 2 but after what I've seen I have no idea anymore. well that'll bring my Algebra grade even lower than it already is. :P
     
    Railos, Aug 10, 2012
    Railos, Aug 10, 2012
    #90

  11. Styx That's me inside your head.

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    M. Get it?
     
    Styx, Aug 10, 2012
    Styx, Aug 10, 2012
    #91

  12. Kubo Kingdom Keeper

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    Don't compare me with other mathematicians.
     
    Kubo, Aug 10, 2012
    Kubo, Aug 10, 2012
    #92

  13. Makaze Some kind of mercenary

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    You're probably right. You're only in training to be one.
     
    Makaze, Aug 10, 2012
    Makaze, Aug 10, 2012
    #93

  14. Kubo Kingdom Keeper

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    Not realy. If you don't know how things work, then don't make assumptions.
     
    Kubo, Aug 10, 2012
    Kubo, Aug 10, 2012
    #94

  15. Makaze Some kind of mercenary

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    Likewise, do not assume you know how things work at any point. You are making a "tu quoque" argument.

    You are easily provoked, this I observe directly. If a defining or labeling comment is made about you that you dislike, you decry the other as not knowing enough to judge. Perhaps you will play the same exact card in response to this. "You have much to learn" or the like. This also I directly observe.

    You do not defend your pride very well for someone who felt the need to respond to me. And it was a need because you did it. Or have you given in to doing unnecessary things?
     
    Makaze, Aug 10, 2012
    Makaze, Aug 10, 2012
    #95

  16. Llave Superless Moderator

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    Makubo? Makubo.
     
    Llave, Aug 10, 2012
    Llave, Aug 10, 2012
    #96

  17. What? 『 music is freedom 』

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    Makaze-chan, please take the trolling elsewhere.

    If you wish to get into debates then I recommend going back to the mathematics I mean what.

    Here is a question for you. Why are you not very happy over imaginary numbers?
     
    What?, Aug 10, 2012
    What?, Aug 10, 2012
    #97

  18. Makaze Some kind of mercenary

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    Not all imaginary numbers, just the infinite series specifically. I am not happy that .99999... is considered equivalent to 1 because there is no point for me at which the difference would become insignificant. No number in the series .99999... is equivalent to 1, so how can the series itself be? That bothers me.
     
    Makaze, Aug 10, 2012
    Makaze, Aug 10, 2012
    #98

  19. Kubo Kingdom Keeper

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    Clearly you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about... What don't I know about? You assumed I'm the training guy, how does this make me not knowing how things work lol? Are you trying to start an argument with yourself? That's ****ed up! If you want just let me know, and in a few months you will have a brother (or perhaps sister) with whom you can argue any time you want. =]
     
    Kubo, Aug 10, 2012
    Kubo, Aug 10, 2012
    #99

  20. Mixt The dude that does the thing

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    I don't understand this point. 1+2+3 is a very simple series that results in 6 but no number in the series was 6. Why then would a series be forced to use the number 1 to get to 1?
     
    Mixt, Aug 10, 2012
    Mixt, Aug 10, 2012
    #100
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