Kingdom Hearts II Axel Riku's nobody? (Theory on how)

Zexion is mentioned in the Ansem reports and also in the past scene he is mentioned by Ansem the Wise. Zexion was the youngest member of Ansem's apprentices but it is safe to assume he was definitely not 7 years old at the time of his departure to Darkness. No 7 year old would hold that much sway over Ansem to convince him to expand research as is mentioned in the real Ansem Reports. None of the Org seemed to age. Xehanort to Xemnas is show enough in that they look pretty well the same age despite 10 years of separation from that time.

 

Good theory but I disagree. It's probably just a coinceidence that they are so much alike. Plus the name Axel is not an anagramme of RikuX- this is an organisation thing that Xemnas wanted, kind of like a trademark.

You could be right about Riku HAVING a nobody but I don't think it's Axel and Hayner is too younger to be Lexaeus' former somebody, plus it's already known that Lexaues' somebody was an apprentice of Ansem the Wise along with Xehanort, Braig, Dilan, Even and Ienzo- the first six members of the organisation. I might not be making any sense so sorry.

Luxord is English I think- I'm guessing from his accent and Ansem the wise id not I don't think so, they have to be similar like that plus ATW is quite old and he has a heart.

 

Right, I agree with most of that. (Except I think it's possible that only Namine and Roxas age, since they are special and their others were alive.) It's not possible that Zexion was around 7 years old.
I was asking if we had actually seen what Ienzo looked like? You said that Ienzo and Zexion had the same hairstyle and build?
Also, which past scene was he mentioned in?

 

that is an interesting theory

 

Hmm...that's an interesting theory...however, if you remember correctly, all Nobodies within Organization XIII have their names scrambled with an 'x' (excluding Namine). So Riku's name is not Axel's, scrambled, so he could not. Also, Riku never lost his heart. He was consumed by darkness, but he never lost his heart.

Perhaps they just so happened to look similar, that's all. Coincidence, or whatever.

Oh, and as said in one of the Ansem's reports in KHII, when the Somebodies turned into a Nobodies, their appearance change somewhat. So it'd be safe to say when Zexion was Ienzo, he looked basically the same.

 

I guess we didn't though I could swear there was a brief glimpse of him, but I could be wrong. I will look through KH2 logs to see if I find anything but it may have just been Xehanort alone. I just know for sure that in the real Ansem Reports, Ienzo does convince Ansem to further studies and expand things in the beginning, so it does not approach me that he could have been 7 at the time.

However, I don't think really Roxas or Namine aged either, but that is debatable. If you look at both, they seem 'smaller' in their way than Sora and Kairi do when we see them together. The Nobodies all seemed to be rather frozen in 'time' kind of like vampires are, for somewhat a relation, since they were put out of 'existence'. Not sure how to better describe that really, but they no longer had bodies and instead had 'memories' of bodies and their former existences, so I don't think they aged at all.

 

Riku has no nobody, Nomura said so, end of story.

 

I've actually had this debate with a friend before. I won. ^^

It's like, impossible for Axel to be Riku's nobody. Riku never turned into a heartless,his heart was just consumed by darkness, but it was still there. Plus, 'Riku' doesn't scramble into 'Axel', no matter what you do to the names.
Plus... Nomura already said that Riku doesn't have a nobody... ^^"

I think i just repeated what everyone else said.... x_x

 

Oh, I see. Ok. I looked in the background at the scene where we see Xehanort. I didn't anyone except Xehanort, Ansem, and the King. I wasn't paying really close attention, so I might be wrong, but I don't think, in that scene, at least, that we saw any of the apprentices, and I can't think of another scene where we'd see them.

Right, that's true, he said that in the Secret Ansem Reports. It was in the second one:

So I agree, it doesn't seem likely that Ienzo was only around 7 years old at the time.

Going on the premise that they don't have real bodies, that makes perfect sense.
Except Namine's and Roxas' others (somebodies?) were alive, which could have influenced whether they aged or not. They (well, I don't know about Namine, but Roxas, at least) didn't have memories of their somebodies or their former existences, so if I understand your theory, they shouldn't have had any form at all. Obviously they did, so maybe it's possible that the fact that their others were alive made a difference.

I don't know if that made any sense or not, but also:



The first is the 3-D model for Namine in Re:CoM, and the second is the 3-D model for Namine in KH2.

Why would they go through the trouble of making Namine look younger just for Re:CoM if she didn't age? A year went by in between Re:CoM and KH2.



If Roxas doesn't age, shouldn't he be shorter than Sora?

 

I dunno. I mean, I've noticed the similarities and everything and thought about it. I thought that maybe they could be connected in some way, but no. I don't really agree. Axel rearranged is not Riku and yes, I know, Namine' and Kairi don't match up either, but that's only because Kairi's heart was in Sora's body, so her name couldn't be something like Kairix. :P. I've considered this as a possibility before, but I don't think it's possible. Riku never became a heartless, so the connection just doesn't work out. The similarities are either mere coincidence, or the creater was toying with our heads.

 

I have a hard time seeing how these two look similar. Riku is much broader, with different hair color, style, and length, and a different fighting style. Since Riku weilded a sword then a keyblade, Axel should have used something along the lines of a keyblade or Soul Eater. And Axel's element is fire, which has nothing really to do with Riku.

Plus the fact that Riku never lost his heart to darkness, only succumbed to its power and only lost his body to Ansem's purposes.

 

xD nice, keyblade, and i really do hope you are joking. xD

As for YOU!

Axel and Riku are definately not nobody/somebody. No way. I mean, yeah, Riku was in Sora's heart- mentally. Not litterally and physically like Kairi was. And Kairi DID turn into a heartless, in a manner of speaking, but she was pure of heart, so there was no darkness to take over. Her heart found Sora, thus creating Namine.

Riku never had a nobody. Ever. He never became a heartless. The darkness he gave himself up to did not necissarily change him in that way... he was still connected to himself. And if Axel was Riku's nobody, there would be no Riku, I don't think. He'd be some heartless Sora had killed a long time ago. Because I don't think you could repeat the Kairi/Sora heart situation.... too specific.

Repliku sums it up for you nicely, and like Larxel_Lover said--
Tetsuya likes to make his characters similar is the only coincidence here.

 

Roxas I believe looks exactly like Ven, so really he's connected to Sora and all but I think he's a unique Nobody that lost his 'body' but well, he may have had his spirit more in tact than the other Nobodies did, and part of his Heart which let him be a Keyblade wielder at all. He had a lack of memories because as was described in KH and in the Ansem Reports in KH2 I believe, Sora was a Shadow and as he felt his memories begin slipping from him, Kairi changed him back to himself. Roxas did not receive the memories but he was formed because Sora had lost his body and willingly went to Darkness, but Sora did not completely lose his memories, so Roxas did not inherit them. However, Roxas obviously had enough of a will and spirit to become a higher Nobody and have his form as he could closely recall it.

As for the pics of Namine, they look the same really except one is more 'chibi' in effect. She has the exact same hair, clothes etc. Nothing changes on her but the difference in drawing styles between KH-CoM and KH2. If you look at all of the characters from KH to KH2, they all grew taller and thinner in ways and lost some of the 'anime' looking eyes and Disney sorts of features. Their features became a bit more 'real' even though some of the kids are way too thin in KH2, where as in KH they had more exaggerated tones to them of the art. So I wouldn't say that Namine changed much at all from CoM to KH2.

It could be possible though that as Sora and Kairi aged, perhaps Namine and Roxas did some too, but Roxas in 358/2 days pretty much looks the same despite the fact he should be younger than Sora in kh2, so I'm not sure. Of course, telling someone's age as being 6-8 months younger can be difficult, but with that growth spurt in there in the teen years, it could be easier. Since they do have 'somebodies' though, I would guess that theory may be plausible. As for the others though, I'm fairly certain none of them aged since their time as Nobodies.

As for why the Nobodies are that way, when a Heartless consumes the Heart, it also destroys the person's body. However, a Nobody is formed from the probable 'soul' of a person remaining behind, along with an element that ties them to 'existence' and Darkness that forms the body. The body is not a 'real' body as in flesh and blood, and is from the memories of the soul which forges that element and darkness to a solid form. The 'heart' is absent but they do realize it is gone. Most of the Organization at least had 'some' memories and could recall what it was like to have their former Hearts. Especially the top 6 who willingly experimented on people and went to Darkness of their own volition. Since they have these memories (whether complete or not, there has to be a will that would let the person even bother becoming a higher Nobody or they'd come back as what they 'related' to in life..which would resemble one of the lesser Nobodies) they come back reborn into this new body that resembles the former one but is not that former one.

Lord Knight Xiron
I agree with you. I really am not seeing much likeness between Axel and Riku and the pictures you posted are even more glaringly pointing it out. Also, Axel ended up with Fire element as a Nobody. Wouldn't Riku's end up with Earth since his name and his strength seems to all symbolize 'land' which is his namesake? However, he looks nothing like Lexaeus. I'm sure all of the Nobodies are not also related at all to the Final Fantasy characters either. I don't think Nomura would take such a short cut and would want them all original.

 

Hmm...Nice thought.But i don't think that it is quite right...For example,isn't the name of the organisation members Something+x?Riku's name has nothing to do with axel's,hayner's nothing to do with lexaus and so goes...Buut it was nice,logical thinking anywayz... ^^

 

I always thought that, hypothetically speaking, it just might be possible for Riku to have a Nobody. The whole thing with his - mind? - being sent to the Dark Realm was a little iffy. But even if Nomura hadn't said so himself, it would be too much to have Riku have his own Nobody. It's a bit.. fanficish, if that makes any sense. As for Axel... no. Just no. Perhaps he parallels Riku, being Roxas' friend, but they do not have any further connection.

I don't know about Nobodies not aging at all. Between the ages of 20 and 30, I've often noticed that there is no substantial difference in a person's looks. And in the cutscene where we see Xehanort, he does seem a bit younger than Xemnas. Not even really physically, but he seems to have a younger air about him. Plus his voice isn't as deep as Xemnas'. But I'm not sure about this. Just a couple of thoughts.

 

It wasn't his "mind" that got sent to the realm of darkness. That's just an easier way of putting it. Its a combination of his heart and soul that left his body when Ansem took it over, without either his body dying or his soul going to the afterlife. Since his heart and soul never separated, a Nobody is impossible.

As for Hayner being Lexaues' other, nuh-uh. Look up your KH lore, peeps. Lexeaus is the nobody of Aeleus, the fifth apprentice of Ansem the Wise, alongside Xehanort, Braig, Dilan, Even, and Ienzo. And Hayner and Lexeaus could not co-exist, since that was what made Roxas such a special nobody, other than Sora getting his heart back and being a key-bearer.