A question for all you anime fans

So like this has been bugging me for quite awhile now but i still don't understand...
What's with all the hate against Naruto and Bleach?
Wherever I go to, I would always see both of those shows being rubbed off the wrong way.
I mean there are some people that dislike it for a reason, i don't mind that but there are those who just bash on it for no reason at all.
Bleach i can see why a little bit. The plot and story was good yet the fillers just f*cked it up which cause a repetitive sequence in the arcs.
Still though. Everywhere i go (YouTube, XBL PSN, Playfire, and others) i always see both of those shows being compared to other shows in a very negative way. For instance on YouTube and XBL I would read/hear insults like "Naruto *** boy "
or "go back to your bleach "
Basically bashing on people who like them.
Yeah I never really understand that at all. It's alright to not like it or anything, we all have our opinions but at least have a reason.

 

^This

 

the Bleach anime is admittedly pretty abysmal. I didn't watch after ep 200ish.



Basically, this is your typical non-mainstream hating on the mainstream for being mainstream.
You see it with movies, music, everything, and anime is no different.


I don't really watch anime myself, so I could be wrong, but I'm probably not, because it sounds exactly like a less intelligent version of what I would say to someone regarding mainstream music.



Also, lol at you for feeling disgusted at yourself for liking something other people bash. Have some pride in what you enjoy, don't be a little bitchboy.

 

because they're slow and boring. they're supposed to be battle anime but they only spend 5% of the whole show fighting because after every punch, a character needs to monologue to themselves or the opponent for the rest of the episode

DBZ is the exact same way and i know the only reason i like it is because nostalgia

 

I say it's completely fine to like any anime or other media of the sort, regardless if the label "mainstream" attached to it deems it negative.

Haterz are just gonna hate, yo.

 

I wouldn't say that they're boring, just slow. Then again, I like seeing lots of plot before the action occurs.

Naruto can get pretty ridiculous with its recaps. The most recent episode that was shown on Toonami must have been at least half recap. The filler would also be unforgivable, but at least it tries to relate to the plot. Sure, it does a terrible job of relating to the plot, but it still tries. Other than that, it isn't bad, just not good. I like it for nostalgia, which means I'll probably stop watching when they get to episodes that I haven't seen.


As for Bleach, I don't see what's so bad about it. My only complaint about it is that filler arcs are the only times when stuff actually happens. If filler is the best part, there's got to be something wrong.

 

Likely answer? It's the shows' fanbases faults.

 

Bleach
- Characters mean nothing. They're throwaway tools to talk up the big bad and fill chapters with repetitious hack and slash and contrived revelations. There's always some 11th hour power to save MC-kun and things always turn out predictably. Everyone else is supposedly special, except when compared to MC-kun. He's the most speciallest coolest guy ever. Ever. EVER. He's deep because his mom died and they did nothing with that plot line, so it's 'kay.
-Plot means nothing. What is really being said here? It's story of a kid who kicks everyone's ass because he's so cool. He's gotta save the world from the evil evil guy thing person because that guy thing person is so evil and that is not cool.

Naruto
- Plot means nothing. What's really being told here? It's a story of a kid who didn't have everything he wanted growing up so he makes it his life's pursuit to be a huge attention whore. **** hits the fan and he heroes up because he's got this thing that makes him more specialer than all the normal kids who put him down. More **** hits the fan and he gods up because we gotta scale dem power levels. More **** hits the fan and we know the author just stopped writing.
- Character means nothing. There's all cardboard cutouts to stand around MC-kun looking impressed and occasionally fill in a readership gap that doesn't favor the brash antics of MC-kun.

Can I say it's worse than a lot of stuff out there? No.
Can I say that most of what's out there is bad? Yes.
Has most of what's out there been running for 10+ years? No.
Has one or both of these two been running for 10+ years? Yes.
Therefore one or both of these series has had 10+ years to wear on everyone's patience. That's why people complain, because they're sick and tired of this ****.

It's really your choice to pick what you like, but don't try to say something is good or bad without thinking about it from a more objective standpoint. Think, "WHY DO I LIKE THIS?" and "WHAT ABOUT IT MAKES IT GOOD?" If you can't actually figure it out, it's not good. But you don't have to like good things. You can love bad things and not be a bad person. There's nothing wrong with having open or bad taste, just don't force it on anyone else. People with good taste can follow the same advice. Just get the **** along with people or ignore them.

 

Hmmm i think this has answered my question pretty well.
Thank you.

 

You're not reading current Bleach, are you?

I'm not defending it's other flaws, and it is ridiculous that we're just now finding out about it after 500+ chapters, but still.

 

What chapter was i brought up in?
What chapter did they next give more than cursory mention to it?
What chapter did they start to actually do anything with it?

You'll notice that there's more than 100 chapters between each. That gun's had time to rust through.

 

Actually, no.

Before chapter 500ish there were no hints that there was anything special about her from what I can remember. It was just a simple "she was really nice and she died and everyone was sad" scenario.
It wasn't until recently that we officially got word that there was something more to it. Before it had just been speculation. So from the authors standpoint he's not necessarily in the wrong for putting it off this long, because only now is it relevant to what is happening in the story. It could be argued that it didn't come up previously because there was no reason for it to come up, as it had nothing to do with what was going on. It's still frustrating that we had to wait this long, but if you read it, it's important to note that because of what it is, it's necessary that it be part of the last arc in the story. It's not as if the story could have been rearranged for it to be an earlier arc, unless you want the story to be about a boy and his mysterious mother, but that's not what it's wholly about.

 

I used to think naruto was dumb I only watch a few ep. I don't think it's bad but its very repetitive with the action and climaxes. I stopped watching it around ship. S1 or 2.
Bleach I used to like watching the the first season but it then started to be boring with all the action. Someone goes into a powerful form and keeps going higher and higher and its like yea yea i knew that ws going to happen. same with naruto. Idk I can't explain. And some if the lines are real cheesy like one episode where the red head girl yells "don't die ichigo!" With the sun shinning behind her with her cry saying don't give or whatever and I was like give me a break lol.

I mean there's a lot of things that I don't like about them but I at least watch them first before I job. I'm not a big anime fan either.

 

First, I fact checked, there is nothing incorrect about my statement. They first mentioned it with the Grand Fisher. They next mentioned it with the Grand Fisher's reappearance, albeit somewhat tangentially. They finally did something with it well after the defeat of Aizen. Those events are each over 100 chapters apart. So there is no "Actually, no." There's only, "I disagree with your conclusion based on other relevant facts."

Now, I'm saying that this is no longer a reasonable Chekov's gun because the lead was dropped entirely. When they actually come back and "explain" it, it's already been thrown out in favor of another plot point, it's no longer valid. This stuff they're doing now is just filling space until the end.

 

At the risk of spoiling it for someone,

Spoiler

Not once was there anything said about his mother being a Quincy, or that there was something out of the ordinary about her. It was hinted that there was more to her than a simple mother, but that's hardly any implication or statement that she is an important factor.
She was not mentioned around the time Aizen was defeated or afterwards. At that time the person in question was Ichigo's dad.

If I'm wrong link me pages proving so because I'm certain that I'm not wrong, and if I am then my memory is fading.


so yeah, no.

Filling space until the end? This is what it's about and what it's been building up to. If you find it that uninteresting fine, I won't criticize you for that, but this is hardly filler.



(also, please remember I'm not trying to come off as a raging fanboy who think Bleach's story is godly. I'm just trying to prove you wrong)

 

I'm not. You said this:

either we're not on the same page on what we're discussing or you can't make up your mind on what side you're criticizing. I said that there was nothing explicitly said in the story about his mother being more than a mother in response to you saying that they didn't go anywhere with it, and that because of that we had no real reason to expect anything to come of it, aside from fan speculation. Then you say that it was mentioned, now you're saying that it was slightly mentioned, but the fact that they followed through is a bad thing, despite the fact that your first post was criticizing them for not following through with it.


I'm still not convinced you have read up to the current chapter or that your familiar enough with the story to be referencing what is said. I don't like having to tip-toe around spoiling it for someone who will undoubtedly not like it regardless.


I'm not going to look up the pages for someone who is too lazy to give solid evidence for why I'm wrong, if you can't support your own points I'm certainly not going to help you. **** that.


Regardless of how the author has obviously paced it out over a longer period of time than it should have taken, what is going on now is not filler. Filler is inconsequential material meant to add fluff to the story to either cash in or waste time. You can look to the previous arc and individual parts of previous arcs and of the current arc for that. But to say that this arc is, on the whole, filling space, even though this is supposedly the last arc, is wrong given that a) what is happening will affect everything that happens after, b) plot points that had been ignored are being addressed, c) the story is beginning to come full circle by echoing the conflict between two races that took place before the story began, and d) the author said that he had been building up to this. Now, I don't believe for one second that he had everything planned out, and that he didn't make most of this up as he went along, and that he has it all planned out now, but looking back to the tone of the story early in the series, the mystery surrounding a dead race that we heard about so early on, and the dead mother that we suspiciously weren't told anything about, I can kinda believe that he would have thought that these basic, basic, ideas were things that he wanted the last arc to be about.
And of course it's continuing for money. If that is what defines filler, everything that has ever existed in the history of ever in the entertainment industry is filler.

Anyway, I am tired as hell, and have no desire to continue on with this discussion defending something that is as flawed as it is. Like I said early on, I don't disagree with most of the problems people say it has. Someone could go on all day long saying how Bleach is an awful story because of it's flaws, and I would probably agree with them, because they're most likely right. But I'm not about to stop reading a story I have invested the better part of 7 years in. As flawed as it is, it does bring me about 10 minutes of entertainment every week, and that's enough for me to enjoy it.

 

I can't answer for Bleach since I hadn't seen enough of it, but I have been through a lot of Naruto. I actually made it to episode 90 of Shippuden before I just decided to quit all together. I quit partially because I now associate the show with someone I was really close to decided to hurt me in a terrible way, but also because the story was sloppy beyond repair and uninteresting.

Putting my personal issues aside, I can say that the show did have a strong beginning. However, as the series went on, it is obvious that the creators lost interest in the plot by defusing any tension the show may have had and just fill it up with episodes that don't move the plot forward or not show any character growth (basically, filler). I like watching how a character evolves over time, which is why I love certain books, movies, and even anime. However, if you have a lead character that is promising, but then decide to just make him annoying and not have him learn a single lesson, that that's just a waste of time.

So yeah, for me, I dislike Naruto because of sloppy story telling.